twin screw guys... help guide me

[MBH]

I have a question for you... is it worth it?

Now that its all said and done, would you do it again? Any regrets? Anything you miss about the eaton? Please be as honest and specific as possible, because I'm starting to think about a twin screw as a possibility for me.

I think the bearings in my eaton are going south, and I haven't heard back about it being warrantied by stiege or not yet (original owner is asking him for me in case it doesn't transfer). I'd rather save myself the hassle of an extra blower removal/install if I end up going twin screw down the road, and since the bearings may be going south.... it may be a "good" investment for me to do it sooner rather than later.

If I'm going to upgrade, it'll most likely be over the winter.... and I still haven't even taken a ride in another terminator yet, so I think we ought to get some meets together so you can help convince me hahaha :rofl:


You can start a KB/whipple war if you want in this thread, I'm all ears. Seems everybody in the burgh but me is running a KB, so I'll know what to expect. I like the idea of buying a used (new style) KB 2.2 and having it rebuilt because I love that shreik that only those blowers make.... but I like the numbers that the gen ii whipple 2.3 puts down and the appearance of the 2.3 more than the kb. Either way I'd paint it to match my engine just like mine is now, which might make ol kenne look a bit silly.

[MinGry03]

I should have done it sooner. I went from a 2.8 upper to a Steg port with a 2.8 upper. Then two months later, the Whipple with a RR 3.0. I have had the Whipple on for 2 years and the only problem I have had is with the stickers coming off. Whipple's customer service was great when I called there for any questions. This was the main reason I went with Whipple instead of KB. I miss the whine a little bit, but the reliability has been superb. I wish Mark & PJ1 would have talked my wife into it sooner....:thmbsup:

[MBH]

I should have done it sooner.
I knew this was going to come up pretty quick lol. I've heard the same thing with the whipple customer service, although apparently KB just hired some more people to address their customer service issues - at least that is what I've read

Any drawbacks to it?
Are you worried about your motor?
How is your traction (on what tires)?

[Rio94gt]

Dude, traction is going to be an issue with any street tire when youll be pushing the kinda power a twin screw termi puts out.

I dont even have one and i say do it.

[MBH]

Thats understandable, I just wanted to see if it was even useable power if you're in 1st gear or if its out of control. I drive on either 305 nitto 555RII's or on 275 MT ET Street radials and have flsfc for what its worth.

I'm at 520rwhp now with a best trap speed of 127 (realistically 122 w/o icing it down) and IMO traction isn't a problem for my car if there is some heat in the road and in the tires.

I want to do it, I just want to hear what people have to say and try to learn from any mistakes or regrets that they have so I can weigh my options a little better :)

[PunisherStang]

i dont know much about whipples or kbs except they are amazing an put down some serious power, but i think you would have a lot more than 520hp an prolly some traction issues, but there are ways to control the traction issues like suspension mods, an obviously a good sticky tire but i think you have the sticky tire part down from what you mentioned.... i always say to my self you only live once so live your life to the fullest, an dump that eaton an get a whipple or kb an you will have a smile on your face every time you start your car:goodidea:

[89stang]

I dont have a terminator but by budy did. On his he had a whipple and it was mean. 673 hp! Solid rear end. Car was very very fast. Here is A link that might help. I like the looks of the whipple better too.
http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=453313

[MBH]

^o snap, that thread is ugly near the end, thanks for posting that

[89stang]

No problem.

[no1sirbutler]

MBH do and dont look back. I dont personally have a termi but I have a KB on my gt and love it. My good friend has a 2.2 on his termi and is making 700+ to the tires and is very streetable. He drives it just about everyday its nice and runs on Nitto drag radials. His never gets out of control unless you want it to. The control and traction issues will pass once you learn to drive the car again. And if it was me I would go w/ a KB 2.6 or 2.8, they make insane power and they scream when in boost. Hell I heard a 2.6 at the Summit show that was 2 cars behind me and I thought I was about to get run over. lol

[o4c0b|2a]

I would have done it from the start. I bought a used rebuilt (new style) polished 2.2, back when the 2.6's and 2.8's came out. (Knew good deals were to come out for the smaller blowers) and the car flys. I don't like to comment much on the KB vs Whipple war. Especially when people compare the 2.2 kb vs the 2.3 Whipple. Either one will get you were you wanna be, bottom line. If you need a to ride in one, just let me know hah.

[Jcelli04]

IMO its a waste to put another eaton back on. You can pick up a new blower for a reasonable price and there are used ones floating around all over the place. I'd get a 2.6 or 2.8 KB just personal preference. I have a little 1.7 for my GT and i've had a blast in it. I'm looking into upgrading to a 2.6 because its never enough.

Do it and dont look back

[u1arunit]

Keep the ported Eaton. We don't need another 600+RWHP Cobra running around!






























Seriously, just do it.

BUT..

You need to understand that for the twin screws to really shine you need over 17+ boost. That is all well and good but then you really need increased octane and some common sense enough not to abuse the crap out of the car every single minute you're driving it. Every time you go WOT with marginal octane and a little too much boost in hot weather the fuse gets a little shorter. Not trying to scare you, but you asked..

I am not afraid of blowing up as I am very careful in the choices that I make and I have the funds to cover me should that day ever come when it makes its quickest ever pass and she goes BOOM.

BTW you are fooling yourself if you think you will be able to hook in first gear NO MATTER what tire you are running. I cannot hook even in second from a 30-40mph roll unless the tire pressure is deflated a little and they are very hot and this is on wide 315 BFG drag radials!

Good luck in your quest for more power. :goodidea:

[SonofaBish]

My good friend has a 2.2 on his termi and is making 700+ to the tires and is very streetable.

I don't keep up on cobras very well, but i've read first hand from several terminator owners that this is really not possible. I'm not calling you a liar, but from what i've seen, you can't make 700rwhp with just a KB, let alone that little 2.2

Tires:

I think you'll be ok if you have some ET streets on it... granted our cars are compeltely different - i'm putting upwards of 700 to the wheels and my MT's will hold first gear on the street on a summer day. Granted, turbo cars are different, but b/c of a fuel dump that (that needs fixed) right before boost hits, in first gear the power comes in as sudden and hard, if not harder, than a cobra will... I have no problems with traction.

Personally, i don't think you should do it..... Yea its awesome and all, but its a never ending thing... before long, you won't be happy with 600rwhp, and you'll wanna max the blower... then wanna add some nitrous... then you'll wanna go turbo.... and the process will never end... e.g. i'm completely used to the power in my car... and that's scary imho.... you should never be used to so much power...

[White5.0]

Personally, i don't think you should do it..... Yea its awesome and all, but its a never ending thing... before long, you won't be happy with 600rwhp, and you'll wanna max the blower... then wanna add some nitrous... then you'll wanna go turbo.... and the process will never end... e.g. i'm completely used to the power in my car... and that's scary imho.... you should never be used to so much power...

i do not agree with this at all. Nothing at all against you, but i think that is what makes being into cars such a great thing. It's a never ending thing but that is what makes it fun and keeps it interesting. That is like someone who works out saying "well i'm too strong so im gonna stop lifting now." if people just stopped, no one would be into cars for more than a few years.

anyways, my opinion would be twin screw ftmfw. i've never owned a car with one but have been for a few rides and they are downright nasty. And i'm sure you would be happy with either KB or Whipple. both seem to make similar numbers

[no1sirbutler]

I don't keep up on cobras very well, but i've read first hand from several terminator owners that this is really not possible. I'm not calling you a liar, but from what i've seen, you can't make 700rwhp with just a KB, let alone that little 2.2




when did I say thats all he has done? He also has Fox Lake stage 3 ported heads, Comp stage 2 cams and a slew of other stuff done to it. You cant make 700+ w/ just a KB unless you go w/ the 2.8H Mammoth which is an awesome kit but I doubt MBH will buy that one esp since he is worried about traction.

[MBH]

And if it was me I would go w/ a KB 2.6 or 2.8, they make insane power and they scream when in boost. Hell I heard a 2.6 at the Summit show that was 2 cars behind me and I thought I was about to get run over. lol
I thought the new KB's had more of a drone and less of a scream to em? I can't imagine them being louder than my ported heaton... but the sound of the 2.2 is downright spine tingling.


Either one will get you were you wanna be, bottom line. If you need a to ride in one, just let me know hah.
I'd love a ride some time!!! I'd love to get a 2.2 for the sound like I said before, but IDK how much I trust buying a used blower. Bad shit always seems to happen to me when I buy car parts, I swear to God.


IMO its a waste to put another eaton back on.
Not if its free :)


BUT..

You need to understand that for the twin screws to really shine you need over 17+ boost. That is all well and good but then you really need increased octane and some common sense enough not to abuse the crap out of the car every single minute you're driving it. Every time you go WOT with marginal octane and a little too much boost in hot weather the fuse gets a little shorter. Not trying to scare you, but you asked..

I am not afraid of blowing up as I am very careful in the choices that I make and I have the funds to cover me should that day ever come when it makes its quickest ever pass and she goes BOOM.

BTW you are fooling yourself if you think you will be able to hook in first gear NO MATTER what tire you are running. I cannot hook even in second from a 30-40mph roll unless the tire pressure is deflated a little and they are very hot and this is on wide 315 BFG drag radials!

Good luck in your quest for more power. :goodidea:
I really appreciate the honest response. So many people like to think that these engines can hold up to anything you throw at em.. poop happens, and stuff like this just tempts murphy's law (for those that don't know: if something can go wrong, it will). Would it be smarter to keep the eaton? yes. would it be more fun.... haha, well fun is why we have these cars :goodidea:

I'm relatively gentle with the car, I don't get on it all the time, but I do flex the loud pedal a decent amount maybe 1-3 times a trip, usually just a quick 1-2 burst or 2-3 burst depending on where I'm at. The only time I get on the car back to back is when I'm doing something dumb or showing off for a friend who's never been in the car. I don't do any high speed runs or anything crazy like that. You think I'd be an OK candidate for a twin screw w/o running into a catastrophic failure? I run 16psi out of my eaton right now, and I'd probably try to run 18 or 19 lbs on whatever twin screw I get - but I know that a good tune can make or break everything including the motor itself. Also, the car hasn't even turned 11,400 miles yet so its still pretty fresh.

It also worries me about the fact that you're not hooking in 2nd gear. How old are your BFG's? Maybe they're dried out? Thats not really a problem I want, but I guess its a good problem to have.


I don't keep up on cobras very well, but i've read first hand from several terminator owners that this is really not possible. I'm not calling you a liar, but from what i've seen, you can't make 700rwhp with just a KB, let alone that little 2.2

Tires:

I think you'll be ok if you have some ET streets on it... granted our cars are compeltely different - i'm putting upwards of 700 to the wheels and my MT's will hold first gear on the street on a summer day. Granted, turbo cars are different, but b/c of a fuel dump that (that needs fixed) right before boost hits, in first gear the power comes in as sudden and hard, if not harder, than a cobra will... I have no problems with traction.

Personally, i don't think you should do it..... Yea its awesome and all, but its a never ending thing... before long, you won't be happy with 600rwhp, and you'll wanna max the blower... then wanna add some nitrous... then you'll wanna go turbo.... and the process will never end... e.g. i'm completely used to the power in my car... and that's scary imho.... you should never be used to so much power...
Rich's car has head/cam work done. It does make that power, and whats even crazier is that it does so on something like a 10.5:1 a/f ratio. He's got a helluva car!! :)

I normally don't drive around on the mickey's, I'm just breaking em in a bit and getting used to them before I go to the track. But I do have them, so I mentioned it :)


i do not agree with this at all. Nothing at all against you, but i think that is what makes being into cars such a great thing. It's a never ending thing but that is what makes it fun and keeps it interesting. That is like someone who works out saying "well i'm too strong so im gonna stop lifting now." if people just stopped, no one would be into cars for more than a few years.

anyways, my opinion would be twin screw ftmfw. i've never owned a car with one but have been for a few rides and they are downright nasty. And i'm sure you would be happy with either KB or Whipple. both seem to make similar numbers
Sanity/responsibility would suggest against "needing" a 600whp car on the street. With that said... boy would it be more fun! I swear Tim Allen was on the design team for this car "ughh ughh ughh, more power"

Lifting isn't really the best analogy though with cars, but it can still work; people get stronger by routine hard workouts, cars get broken when they get worked out too hard all the time. They're similar though because when you push the envelope on a car or dont let it warm up the way it should (and you're pushing your luck with an aggressive tune or something) you could blow your motor just the same as an olympian can pull a hamstring by not warming up well or by neglecting nutrition/stretching. Both can also have bad shit happen for no apparent reason.

[MBH]

You cant make 700+ w/ just a KB unless you go w/ the 2.8H Mammoth which is an awesome kit but I doubt MBH will buy that one esp since he is worried about traction.
pshh, I was looking to go with the hellion hellraiser kit with twin 61mm turbos on a whipple 3.4 to see if I couldn't squeeze a 4 digit dyno out of the car before it blew sky high

[SonofaBish]

when did I say thats all he has done? He also has Fox Lake stage 3 ported heads, Comp stage 2 cams and a slew of other stuff done to it. You cant make 700+ w/ just a KB unless you go w/ the 2.8H Mammoth which is an awesome kit but I doubt MBH will buy that one esp since he is worried about traction.

holy shit, relax.... i'm just saying, MBH sounds like he wants to just put a KB/whipple on without doing all that stuff.... no reason to give false hope of 700rwhp if its not possible without gobs of other work... but, he really didn't mention a power goal anyhow...


i do not agree with this at all. Nothing at all against you, but i think that is what makes being into cars such a great thing. It's a never ending thing but that is what makes it fun and keeps it interesting. That is like someone who works out saying "well i'm too strong so im gonna stop lifting now." if people just stopped, no one would be into cars for more than a few years.
I don't want my comment to go wrong... i'm not saying i don't enjoy it... obviously i DO.... i just know that for myself, even though i absolutely love my car, there are times i wish i wouldnt have gone so big... its so powerful and so fast, that its tough to find a place to open it up and enjoy it... but then again, when you do open it up and enjoy it, you just wanna keep pushin it to the floor... :)

[MBH]

You're right, I don't have a power goal or an ET goal or a trap speed goal. Butt dyno and fun factor are the most important things to me.

The other drawback of putting the twin screw on is that I'm damn near 100% certain that I'm never going to put a cage in my car, and if I ran the car flat out it would need one for sure. Hell, if I ran it flat out now I'd need one too.

[White5.0]

Lifting isn't really the best analogy though with cars, but it can still work; people get stronger by routine hard workouts, cars get broken when they get worked out too hard all the time. They're similar though because when you push the envelope on a car or dont let it warm up the way it should (and you're pushing your luck with an aggressive tune or something) you could blow your motor just the same as an olympian can pull a hamstring by not warming up well or by neglecting nutrition/stretching. Both can also have bad shit happen for no apparent reason.

thats not exactly how i was trying to compare them but that also works lol. i was thinking more like this: if your into lifting, especially competitively, (or any sport for that matter) there is always someone bigger, better, and stronger than you. And why do you work out? to get bigger better and stronger so you can be competitive at what you do.

same goes for cars for the people that are into them. you are constantly wanting your car/motor to be better, more powerful, more reliable,make better E.T's and trap speeds, be more fun, etc etc. than other people's cars/motors.

but anyways thats just my opinion, not trying to start a war here :thmbsup:

[MBH]

that makes a whole helluva lot more sense than what I made of it the first time lol

[White5.0]

I don't want my comment to go wrong... i'm not saying i don't enjoy it... obviously i DO.... i just know that for myself, even though i absolutely love my car, there are times i wish i wouldnt have gone so big... its so powerful and so fast, that its tough to find a place to open it up and enjoy it... but then again, when you do open it up and enjoy it, you just wanna keep pushin it to the floor... :)

nothing wrong with that, i completely understand where you are comming from with that :thumbsup:

[u1arunit]

It also worries me about the fact that you're not hooking in 2nd gear. How old are your BFG's? Maybe they're dried out? Thats not really a problem I want, but I guess its a good problem to have.


They are brand new. A friend of mine has a tire shop and we ordered them direct from BFG about a month or two ago. No dried out rubber here.

I have a pair of 26/11.50/17 ET Street drag tires as well. They are probably the only hope of totally hooking up that I would have but I only use them for racing and not street use.

BTW lack of traction gets old fast so it's never a good problem to have.

[no1sirbutler]

holy shit, relax.... i'm just saying, MBH sounds like he wants to just put a KB/whipple on without doing all that stuff.... no reason to give false hope of 700rwhp if its not possible without gobs of other work... but, he really didn't mention a power goal anyhow...


I don't want my comment to go wrong... i'm not saying i don't enjoy it... obviously i DO.... i just know that for myself, even though i absolutely love my car, there are times i wish i wouldnt have gone so big... its so powerful and so fast, that its tough to find a place to open it up and enjoy it... but then again, when you do open it up and enjoy it, you just wanna keep pushin it to the floor... :)

sorry if I came off mad Im not, I was just defending my statement. MBH obviously knows Rich(the car I speak of) so he should go for a ride w/ him and see and feel exactly what a twin screw is like on the street.


You're right, I don't have a power goal or an ET goal or a trap speed goal. Butt dyno and fun factor are the most important things to me.

The other drawback of putting the twin screw on is that I'm damn near 100% certain that I'm never going to put a cage in my car, and if I ran the car flat out it would need one for sure. Hell, if I ran it flat out now I'd need one too.

honestly man if you dont have a power goal or an ET goal, i would still do it b/c of the big ass smile you will have on your face every time you do decide to slam the skinny pedal. and I wouldnt worry about the traction issue. If you drive the way you say you do, then it will still drive and act just like your car does now. Or until you decide to press the pedal a little further. lol

[o4c0b|2a]

I'll tell you this, my KDW's are new, and they hook on the street in a 2nd gear roll. 600 hp is good enough, do some rear end, tranny mods. and run 10's all day long. Buying a used blower isn't always a bad idea, I found mine off of modular fords, and the guy I bought it off was real cool, he called me a few times after I bought it to see how it was going etc, and included extra parts for me. Just gotta find the right seller, altho I agree, its not always easy. Good luck on whatever you decide to do.

Thats impressive that a 2.2 head/cam work makes 700 at the wheels, especially on a 10.5:1 ratio. He sounds like to guy to go see Bo. That just almost sounds like too much power on the street haha, especially being close to instant power.

[S+@ng]

ahh ryan, you and your analogies...

[Stangman701]

BTW lack of traction gets old fast so it's never a good problem to have.

That is the main reason I haven't gone twin screw yet. When I'm running regular street tires I wish I had less power and when I got the MT's on I wish I had a little more. I'm kind of curious to see how the new 315 MT's hold up for the twin screw guys. As of now I've got full traction in 1st and it's awesome to be able to rip off some good WOT 1-2 shifts on the street. I think a 315 Mickey should be able to hold 600 in 1st, but if it can't then I don't really want to have that much power.

[o4c0b|2a]

Mine spin in first and grip and go in 2nd. 19#'s on a 2.2. Run newer BFG KDW's 295/35/18. it's not completely unbearable.

[MBH]

Mine spin in first and grip and go in 2nd. 19#'s on a 2.2. Run newer BFG KDW's 295/35/18. it's not completely unbearable.
Thats what I like to hear :)
You'll have to take me for a ride! :hyper::thmbsup:

Ray, I hear ya brother. My car seems to put down the power pretty well now that it has the subframes on, it really cut down on the wheel hop. The only time it has trouble is when the tires are cold or the road is cold, and even then the RPM's just go up and hang a bit - almost like its clutch slip............. which wouldn't be so good - or out of the question for that matter. I do enjoy a good powershift though, and breaking traction wouldn't be too much fun. Funny thing is that my nittos are pretty much silent when they spin, but I spun the mickey's when they were cold form being parked the other day and they screamed.

I think I'm pretty much sold on the 'idea' of the twin screw. Reality could change that though. I'm probably going to upgrade the clutch first and see how much I have left over after that.

[KBCobra]

As most people are saying, I'd agree its a worthy investment (or non-investment so to speak lol). I went from pullied, to adding lower pulley, to port, then to n20, then to kenne bell 2.4. It just never ended up being enough. Def be prepared at any chance to replace a motor. I had 30k HARD miles on my motor before the kenne bell and damn well knew, my motor would be short lived with a KB on top. Sure enough after countless abuse, she hit the bricks. I will definitly say, get a professional on site tune done, don't cut corners. I ran a mail order tune with the KB for about a week till I was able to goto the dyno and get it tuned, what a WORLD of driveability and power difference with a custom tune. I got away running 19lbs on the street for a long time, but most people would advise don't go over 17-18 on pump gas.

I think if you find a decent used 2.2 or even grab a new 2.6, run 17 or so lbs and a good tune, your motor will be fine, especially considering the current miles and how much you drive it. I put a ton of miles on my car and abused it non-stop when I drove, I just beleive in only living once and if I'm gonna dish out payments for the car and money for mods, I'm gonna enjoy it!

[NateSVT]

Do it! You will love the twin screw. I wish I put one on mine sooner. I went from bone stock to pullied, then ported, then KB 2.2. The car is ridiculous with a twin screw. Huge difference from a ported Eaton. After I put the KB on traction was a huge problem when I was running the shitty Sumitomo 315s. They would spin in 3rd gear at around 100, which was kind of fun haha but it sucked if I was racing. This was in April though so it was still pretty cold out. I switched to 315-35-17 BFG G-Force KD's and they hooked great. They spin in first but hook fine in second unless its cold out.
If I was still on the stock motor I would probably run either a 2.2 or a 2.3 on 17-18lbs max for the street. I would probably get the Gen II Whipple because of the great numbers I've seen people put down with them. I have also never heard of anyone having quality issues or having to get one rebuilt. I would definitely miss the scream of the 2.2 tho.
But like Dan said, I would definitely get a good dyno tune. I wish I did haha

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDuLPXunHQQ&feature=user