Transmission choices (long)

[Martin0660]

Looking for some experience or thoughts from those of you that have been there, done it, or even that have looked at the options ... I am going to upgrade transmissions on my Capri this winter. To this point, I have been running the 4 cylinder T5's, they used to live okay, every now and then I would frag a 3rd gear, but they was amazing for what they was (230 ft/lb torque rated transmission running at 350 rear wheel torque) ... Ultimately, when I stepped the power up, they started breaking an all kinds of new ways, even shifting them slow. Clearly I crossed a line with them and an upgrade is needed.


I now have a Quick Time belhousing that allows me to use either a T5 or TKO pattern so the options open up a lot.
I had sort of been held back because I could only get 10 spline clutches that would work for me. After a nice conversation with Spec, they will build me a 3+ with either 10 spline or 26 spline, so another roadblock is removed. In any case, I'm changing clutch becasue the 4 puck without a marcel is killing things, so the cost here isnt an issue.
I had also been pretty locked in on a low 1st gear because the 4 cylinder needs it ... At this point, I'm mostly willing ot add the rear gear needed to make whatever it needs work.
Whatever I do will still need to be syncronized and keep a 5th gear. I drive this car every day in warm months, and would give up on the racing side to keep it a street car.
That all said, here are the options I see and rough prices ...

I can get a new Tremec T5, basically the Z spec rated at 450HP / 330 Torque for $1,295.00 ... All I would need to do with this si turn down the input chaft to fit the 4 cylinder pilot bearing and it's a drop in using everything I have ... Issue I see is that I'm, still above the torque rating, but it's the cheapest option for sure. No matter what option I go with, the input needs turned down to make it work with the 2.3 pilot bearing, the other option is a bushing that fails for guys as it is VERY thin.

I can get a new TKO 500, with the shift enhancement modifications from Liberty's gears for $2,299.00, but add to that a new shifter ($200), a new driveshaft yoke ($70.00), crossmember issues, height issues, etc ... Good is that the torque rating is there plus a 3.27 1st gear, bad is that these things have poor shifting reputations (even with mods), a bit heavier, etc ... Ultimately a faceplated TKO would be great, but I wont live with that unless I have to.

Astro A5 has caught my attention. In the end, this could be G-Force as well ... I can get a fully built A5 from Astro for $2595.00, rated as 485 ft/lbs and 550 HP ... if this is true, I'm not going to exceed this. I will be changinf clutches no matter waht so the 26 spline isnt an issues and I now feel the 2.95 1st, with my 4.10 gear can work with enough launch RPM :D

Roughly i'm not considering G-Force becasue of the failures out there. I know everyone has issues, it just seems that they dont help with theirs ... That's why Astro is leading in my mind (again, input would be appreciated).

There is also the option for sure to buy the Astro A5 Kit ($1,350), add in a full rebuild kit ($300.00), a cluster support kit ($50.00), and even go as far as a new G-Force case ($350.00), add in misc stuff and some labor, and be less than $2,400.00 for a pretty stout "T5" based tranny. I get to keep my shifter, go 26 spline clutch.

Obviously, everyone can see I could go with a PA performance C4, manual body with a brake, converterm etc and likely be cheaper in the end ... It simply is NOT happening ,so it's not a discussion. There are way too many hurdles to making a C4 work with a small discplacement turbo 4 for it to be viable, and in the end, this is a fun street car and that will kill it.

So thoughts are appreciated. I had really thought the TKO was where I was going, but now I've changed to thinking a lot more of the A5 option (either bought or as a pile of parts) ... The other benefit to staying roughly T5 based is I can switchback to my spare T5's in a pinch without big changes ... The TKO changes a lot.

[349Stroker]

Astro is the way to go.....be the last tranny you buy and the G force case is an overated option. if you I can get Steve to build you one and if you have a core that would be a plus..He has gotten cores from you before and is an Astro dealer..If you want his number I'll pm you it

[Martin0660]

Yes, please PM me his number. I lost it a while ago, and sort of forgot about him as an Astro dealer.

[gmkillr]

I had a G-force t-5 built by Bob Hanlon and it took a few years of beating with 450+ rwtq and some 5000-6000 launches and it never missed a beat. I was also running a Ram HD Powergrip clutch and it worked great!

[HOTMARK7]

Had promotion performance build me a t5 for my Mark VII, rated 650, 650 in a heavy car. Got .59 od and it drops rpm 950 with 355 gears. Really nice tranny and they make them with lower hp and tq, also went with McLeod street twin, good for 800 horse and less pedal pressure than my 95 GT, and very street friendly.

[Martin0660]

I had a G-force t-5

I'm really not hearing good things on G-Force these days ???? I know a few guys that have been die hards with their parts, but told me they would not buy new now. Might be old info, but they said stuff was breaking random and G-Force left them on their own.

FWIW, clutch choice for me isnt an option, I have to run certain things. The options that work for V8 stuff arent the same when I am limited to using a 9 1/4" clutch. Effectively, two options, Spec 3+ with a Marcel spring, and Clutchnet 4 puck without ... I'm going back with a Marcel option to soften things a bit. The issue was Spec didnt build it on a 26 spline plate, but now agreed to do it for me :D

[HOTMARK7]

The reason I mentioned McLeod was mine is only using a 9 inch Honda pressure plate and two discs so figured the smaller plate would work.

[Martin0660]

The reason I mentioned McLeod was mine is only using a 9 inch Honda pressure plate and two discs so figured the smaller plate would work.

Gotcha ... I sure wish it would, and I have talked with McLeod about making some of their stuff work. The issue is, we don't have the clearance needed, and our market isnt big enough to justify the needed changes :( ... Even to get Quicktime to make our bellhousings, we had a big buy in at high cost to get it done ... If I was a road racer there are some nice twin disc options, but they all use flex plates and are 7 1/4" stuff ... All of them are very low mass, and my junk would stall on the line if I gave up flywheel mass. We can't even really use an aluminum flywheel, it gives up too much. One of the lousy issues we have to deal with.

[SK@StreetLethal]

Bob I would stay away from the astro t5. My personal experience with them in an 11.70 fox body was not great. Lasted three months from the very begining it would pop out of second gear. They blamed the shifter two shifters later same thing. Ended up swapping in the turbo coupe t5 I had been running and it was still holding up when I sold it. I agree on the tko's every once in a while you will get one that shifts and works perfectly. How about a 6 speed? I am very impressed with how nice most of them shift!

[Martin0660]

Lasted three months from the very begining it would pop out of second gear.

Good feedback, but a question ... how long ago was this? My understanding is that for a while Astro was using G-Force parts ... Because of a number of issues they quit doing that and made the A5 gear sets on their own.


Ended up swapping in the turbo coupe t5 I had been running and it was still holding up when I sold it.

LOL, that's what i'm running now, the issue is I'm breaking them. Seems like I'm just across the line on them ... they used to hold up fine, now i'm breaking them in gear, splitting blocker rings, all kinds of strange things. I was blaming myself, but several guys I trust told me they ran into the same issues at the same level and not runnign a clutch with a marcel is making it worse.



I agree on the tko's every once in a while you will get one that shifts and works perfectly. How about a 6 speed? I am very impressed with how nice most of them shift!

That'sd my fear on the synco'd TKO ... pretty much what i'm told .. .crap shoot unless you face plate.

Most of the 6 speeds are troublesome to get in my car, but I guess I havent looked at them real close ... got a model in mind?

[ModularMike]

I haven't read any of this except for the title, but chick stick FTW!

[349Stroker]

Steve has built Astros for several people on corral and they were all pleases including one guy who had a turbo car that went low 9's @ 145


Astro has its on gears and are way better than G force gears. Much stronger...better quality...all around better stuff


Steve has never had one complaint on anything other than a G Force main shaft went bad

[349Stroker]

and I would use a TKO if someone gave me one and put it in my car for me....Worst shifting thing I have ever seen

[SK@StreetLethal]

Good feedback, but a question ... how long ago was this? My understanding is that for a while Astro was using G-Force parts ... Because of a number of issues they quit doing that and made the A5 gear sets on their own.



LOL, that's what i'm running now, the issue is I'm breaking them. Seems like I'm just across the line on them ... they used to hold up fine, now i'm breaking them in gear, splitting blocker rings, all kinds of strange things. I was blaming myself, but several guys I trust told me they ran into the same issues at the same level and not runnign a clutch with a marcel is making it worse.




That'sd my fear on the synco'd TKO ... pretty much what i'm told .. .crap shoot unless you face plate.

Most of the 6 speeds are troublesome to get in my car, but I guess I havent looked at them real close ... got a model in mind?
The d&d magnum models shift perfectly! Brian has been abusing one for the past year at above their rated levels with no issues. It was an a5 gearset but to be fair it was 3 or 4 years ago.

[SK@StreetLethal]

Steve has built Astros for several people on corral and they were all pleases including one guy who had a turbo car that went low 9's @ 145


Astro has its on gears and are way better than G force gears. Much stronger...better quality...all around better stuff


Steve has never had one complaint on anything other than a G Force main shaft went bad


Not to argue but i called and complained multiple times and got told it had to be the shifter. So I tried two different ones and had the same issue. It never "broke" per say as in shattered a gear or anything but had a nasty habit of kicking out of second gear. I had it fixed by a local guy (he posts on here under lx2nv) and it's now in a different car functioning flawlessly. Again it wasn't a parts issue it was an assembly issue.

[Martin0660]

I haven't read any of this except for the title, but chick stick FTW!

Damn ... I knew I should have put "no autotragic" in the title for those with short attention spans

[went9s]

I have a g force t-5 (26 spline)if you want to inspect one up close.

[Martin0660]

Thanks Adam, I might take you up on that. I'm out of town this week, but maybe next week or something.

[went9s]

:thmbsup:let me know.

[Stroked03Cobra]

+1 on the Magnum. Iv been reading and reading and if you can make the parts work with your car its almost a no brainer. If you need more than the 700 tq rating, RSgear makes the magnum in an 800 tq rating with a low first gear for around $3,400ish. The base magnum i believ is right around $2799ish.

[yeahloh95]

i think a t-5 dog ringed for third ,would work great

[White2011]

i have a tko 600 in a 72 nova 427 sbc,i would not recomend it ,mine took 3rd gear main/cluster and1st/2nd syncro, cost over 700 in parts, plus it never shifted very good over 6000 rpms

[PaxtonShelby]

I bet that stroker sounds pretty darn mean over 6k...

[Steve-0]

I think my brother has a gforce t5 in the turbo v6, I'll have to ask him about it, or get him to respond to this.

[Ares]

Long as I stay with a manual trans Bob it will be faceplated 2-3-4. I saw a TKO500 for sale for a grand too comes with a 4.6 bell which is useless for you but still not bad price. Especially if it has the gearing your looking for.

[TooFast98Cobra]

Bob my Pure Street friend has 6 G-force t-5's trans all in good working order, I'm sure he can let one or two go pretty cheap. let me know.....Bill

[Martin0660]

Looked int othis optio na bit more, and the parts are the issue ... I've got a LOT in a SFI bellhousing for the 2.3 now, and no option for that bolt pattern. It's mostly not an option.

[QUOTE=White2011;293754]plus it never shifted very good over 6000 rpms

Thanks for that, generally what I've been told ... and why the TKO's scare me.


I'll have to ask him about it, or get him to respond to this.

Thanks :awsome:


Long as I stay with a manual trans Bob it will be faceplated 2-3-4. I saw a TKO500 for sale for a grand too comes with a 4.6 bell which is useless for you but still not bad price. Especially if it has the gearing your looking for.

For sure some deals out there on them ... A faceplated trans really isnt a great option for me, I just drive too much to live with that.


Bob my Pure Street friend has 6 G-force t-5's trans all in good working order, I'm sure he can let one or two go pretty cheap. let me know.....Bill

Thanks Bill, need to talk to you. Does he have so mant because they break a lot ;)

[TBone7281]

I think my brother has a gforce t5 in the turbo v6, I'll have to ask him about it, or get him to respond to this.

Original price: $1600
GForce T-5 assembled by ProMotion Performance
2.94 Ratio synchro 9310 high alloy gearset/ 94-95 T5 mustang kit
Final gear is 59% OD (.59 ratio)
Transmission was blueprinted and "custom assembled" whatever that means.

Not a many miles on it, but we never had any problems with it. The stock T-5 lasted less than 3 weeks (street only) once the turbo went on. The GForce lived through several track excursions, so that is certainly a step in the right direction. I don't know what it would take to get it to work in your Capri, but it is for sale if you're interested. (The speedo is the main issue I can think of.)

[Martin0660]

For those following along at home ...

Mostly have a decission, and suprisingly based on where I was, I'm going with G-Force. I have a good core to build on and am going to start ordering the parts for the build and have it put together.

I'm so tired of looking at the options, but ultimately, just oo many out there working this way to not go this route.

Thanks to everyone for input!

[yeahloh95]

Do you need a rebuild kit?

[Martin0660]

Do you need a rebuild kit?

I think i've asked like 5 times ... how much ;)

Not sure what i'm going to do for sychro's now, thinking of different than the FMS parts ...

[349Stroker]

Bob...i've had a few G Force trannies and broke 3rd only once....steve wiped out 3rd three times and an input...my friend wiped out a brand new trans oon street tires...you will see if you buy just a kit and do it yourself....the 3-4 part of the main shaft slideson and 95% of the time are sloppy and rock back an forth oon the shaft and that to me is poor machining. also when 3rd breaks its a $500 fix. With Astro it is press fit and 3rd and 4th are seperate and is a $250 fix....plu all G Force uses first gear out of a tremec T5....it isnt even a stronger gear....if you had a g force kit and astro kit side by side you would see the superior quality astro offers. they arent even comparable...plus you can see the poor quality of metal g force has went to because after the tranny has a few miles on it you can see all the pits in the gears...like i said though hope it works. i have had a couple of thm and havent had too bad of luck....but we have been looking for a broekn astro tranny and have yet to even hear of one