Turbo Focus build #2

[sutyak]

This second build is going to stretch into 2013 and will be broken down into phases. Since I will be the one tuning it this will greatly simplify the adjustments I have to make.

Phases
1) Swap out the IHI/16T hybrid turbo for a GT2871r (Target: June 2012)
This will involve welding in a wastegate flange for an external wastegate, the dump tube, and a few inches of new downpipe. The turbine outlet is a 2.5" v-band flange, which will immediately open to a 3" downpipe. Tune for the 8psi wastegate spring. No boost adjustment yet.

2) Cossie knock-off intake manifold. (Target: July/August 2012)
This involves moving the power steering reservoir and re-routing some lines. I may do a detailed write-up of this if I have time. Adjust tune. May add boost controller and go to 10psi if logs look OK.

3) Built motor (2013)
There are still many variables here to account for. The only part I have in hand at the moment is a set of 88mm 10.1:1 Supertech pistons. These were used in a 2.3 build for a few thousand miles, and started life closer to 10.6:1 and were professionally milled to a lower compression.
The current plan is to use the stock 2.0 head and cams, but that could change.

My original goal was ~400whp, but instead of jumping ahead I think I'm going to shoot for ~300whp and leave some room for future fuel system upgrades for a phase 4. Basically I'll push it until I nearly max out the stock fuel system.
I considered lower compression pistons, but I decided I'd rather run the slightly higher compression to start with and if I want to go lower I'll use a thicker had gasket. If I started with lower compression and wanted to go higher it will cost much more to mill the head vs. buying a thicker head gasket.

This build will not be real-time like my first one (I have 2 kids now), but I will provide photos and write-ups once phases are complete.

NOTE: This is not now nor will ever be a dyno queen. I will post dyno results if I happen to go with a group for a dyno day. Please don't skip around this thread and expect to find a dyno sheet. This isn't that kind of build. I'm far more likely to provide datalog information and 1/4 mile track times than dyno charts.

Parts list (on shelf)
GT2871R turbo (T3, 63ar, 2.5" v-band out)
Tial 38mm wastegate & dump tube piping
T3 Log manifold from build #1
55lb injectors
Cossie knock-off intake manifold

Parts list (Still to purchase. PM me if you have and want to sell.)
2.0 Connecting rods (leaning towards K1)
Rod bearings
Head gasket (can't decide between Fel-Pro or Cometic and also thickness)
Bottom end gasket kit
Top end gasket kit
Torsen LSD
Clutch (Exedy Hyper Single or maybe even the Clutchmasters FX700)
MAFia for 2005+ Ford (had one, went to 3" MAF so I sold it. Now I think I'll need one again)
60lb injectors
Drag wheels + slicks
Boost controller (might go with electronic)
Larger intercooler

Parts credit (I'll had to this for any person/company who cuts me a deal on parts)
- Top Speed for 38mm Tial wastegate ($150 lightly used was a good deal)
- Tantalus for pistons
- koke'sfocus for intake manifold

Pictures

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120419_112452.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120531_150015.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120526_114449.jpg

I'm more of a Coke Zero guy, but for some reason there are Pepsi cans around when I take pictures. http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smile_confused.gif
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120526_114611.jpg

I figure this might help some people if they are considering the GT2871r.
If my calculations are correct my Phase 1 at 8psi will be peak at the intersection of 1.7 Pr and 27.7 lbs/min at 7K RPM. I can't wait to run it at 20+psi/2.7Pr and let it ride that island to 45lbs/min! http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smile_strongman.gif I'm fairly certain that will require a return-style fuel system.
These are just estimates. I'd have to do some data logging to map out real-world results. I might do just that. Mapping the lb/min and RPM from the datalog on the compressor map should be very helpful. I did that with the IHI but didn't post it.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/GT2871R-CompressorMap.jpg

-3AN .035 oil restrictor
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120605_123050.jpg

Compressor outlet adapter. These are surprisingly expensive at $40 from ATP Turbo.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120605_122726.jpg

[sutyak]

I started installing the GT2871r today. The fit isn't as perfect as I thought, but it does fit. The turbine housing angle is a bit different than the IHI I built the manifold for and the result is a rather large gap between the block and the turbo. The new turbo is positioned up about 1" and out 1", putting the compressor housing almost against the coolant lines.
I did break one of the plastic coolant T's on removal so I'll be hitting Napa for another one. (PN 660-1593)

I'm still debating whether to dump the wastegate or pipe it back into the exhaust. I'll probably run it dumped at first.

I also broke off one of the nipples on the evaporator for probably the 4th time. I'm getting tired of gluing it back on. http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smile_facepalm.gif

Completed:
- Remove old turbo
- Mock up new turbo and determine necessary modifications to piping

To do:
- Modify downpipe for 3" V-band
- Modify hot site pipe (eliminates a 90* bend)
- Modify ambient pipe
- Route coolant lines
- Mock up wastegate
- Weld in wastegate and route dump
- Datalog and tune


The gap. It's unnecessary but hey I'm not going to hack up my manifold if I don't have to.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9702.jpg

IHI RHB52/16T hybrid vs. GT2871r
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9673.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9681.jpg

The new beast:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9696.jpg

And one more for fun:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9662.jpg

[sutyak]

...and one for my SCS peeps.
Yes, I use that water bottle every single day. :rofl:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9701.jpg

[yeahloh95]

Very cool thanks for all the info

[sutyak]

Downpipe is complete and I also replaced the horrible compression style clamps with 3" v-band clamps. Next up is the wastegate, which I decided to route back into the exhaust. I'm going to mount the wastegate on the underside of the manifold (since there is room), that way all pipes will be nice and short.

Old downpipe for the Tbird IHI compared to the new downpipe for the GT2871r:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9757.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9747.jpg

v-band!
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9741.jpg

Old leaky junk vs. v-band
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9732.jpg

[venom]

Damn dude. Cool shit.

[John4cam]

Are you doing all the fab work?

[sutyak]

Are you doing all the fab work?
Yes sir

[sutyak]

Finished up the wastegate flange tonight. I know the manifold isn't beautiful, but it was also one of the first welding project I ever did 5 years ago. So, don't judge too harshly on those old welds. I've had to repair a couple cracks, but overall it's actually held up very well.. it's just ugly. :)
Next up is the return line from the wastegate to the exhaust. Last fab stuff is some minor modifications to the intercooler pipes, coolant lines to the turbo then ready to dial in the tune!
EDIT: I decided I want to use a flex pipe between the wastegate and main exhaust pipe. I'll work on something else until that arrives.

38mm flange for Tial:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9760.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9763.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9769.jpg

I haven't positioned the vacuum ports yet.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9771.jpg

Fairly direct shot to the downpipe from the wastegate. That is tomorrow's project.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9779.jpg

[sutyak]

I'm making progress on the wastegate return pipe. I determined I do not like the angle of entry into the exhaust, so I'm going to cut off that angled part and make it more of a 45 degree entry instead of 90.
Overall I'm pleased with the progress, considering how little time I'm able to put into it.
I ended up making a 38mm flat flange because I was short one. The moral of that story is: keep everything. :) The piece of metal was from my buddy's F150 diesel that we replaced the water pump in 5 years ago. It was part of the A/C bracket.

Tomorrow I'll finish the wastegate return, modify the hot side intercooler piping, modify the ambient pipe, and if I have time hook up the water and oil lines to the turbo.

Sorry for the cell phone pics tonight.

The A/C bracket, I mean flange:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120629_090532.jpg

Wastegate return
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120629_214834.jpg

This is the angle I'm going to tweak to more of a 45:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120629_214847.jpg

Where that flange was used:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120629_214949.jpg

[Viper_ed]

Just let the waste gate dump to the atmosphere.

[sutyak]

Just let the waste gate dump to the atmosphere.
Don't want the noise. From all I've read dumping it to atmosphere doesn't result in any hp gains, just more noise. I also like hearing the turbo and not just the exhaust.

[Martin0660]

Nice work!

FWIW, I run mine dumped and most are hard pressed to notice it's dumped if it's on high boost. Flow comes off a turbine wheel in a spiral pattern following the outsdie of the pipe. When you bring a gate dump back into the stream it interupts that pattern and causes turbulence than can hurt flow. EVERY application and placement is different and most of arent pushing turbine flow to the limit that it matters ... I dumped mine for packaging reasons and am happy with that decission.

On EDIT - Further to my point about turbine flow control and effects, notice the evolution of turbine wheel design ... Look at your IHI versus your GT series. Notice how the blades are shaped different and more curved as the designs evolved. Further, here is my Precission 5557 turbine, this is another step in that design, the curve is now even further evolved to deal with flow as it comes off the tips and move toward more laminar flow versus spiral flow ...

http://inlinethumb53.webshots.com/45364/2334263870066453426S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2334263870066453426codAUC)

Again, likely not important to your goals, just a fun discussion ;)

[sutyak]

Nice work!

FWIW, I run mine dumped and most are hard pressed to notice it's dumped if it's on high boost. Flow comes off a turbine wheel in a spiral pattern following the outsdie of the pipe. When you bring a gate dump back into the stream it interupts that pattern and causes turbulence than can hurt flow. EVERY application and placement is different and most of arent pushing turbine flow to the limit that it matters ... I dumped mine for packaging reasons and am happy with that decission.

On EDIT - Further to my point about turbine flow control and effects, notice the evolution of turbine wheel design ... Look at your IHI versus your GT series. Notice how the blades are shaped different and more curved as the designs evolved. Further, here is my Precission 5557 turbine, this is another step in that design, the curve is now even further evolved to deal with flow as it comes off the tips and move toward more laminar flow versus spiral flow ...

Again, likely not important to your goals, just a fun discussion ;)

Very interesting. That info could help me decide exactly how to dump the wastegate back into the exhaust to follow the spiral flow and not interrupt it as much. :awsome:

I forgot to mentioned I caught my pants on fire tonight.
I was welding in cut-off shorts and my leg felt abnormally warm.. a 5" wide section of the frays was burning. :laughing:

[yeahloh95]

very good info bob , i really want a turbo on my focus too

[PaxtonShelby]

Really cool project. Can't wait to see the finished product.

[sutyak]

Never a dull moment. It's very convenient having a spare motor to mock up things, but I forgot that I don't have any accessories on that spare motor! After I finished welding up the wastegate return and went to mount it on the car I quickly realized the wastegate is hitting the alternator! I could 1) cut and reweld the wastegate routes 2) grind down part of the alternator or 3) grind down part of the wastegate. The wastegate lost. :rotflol:
The side wastegate nipple was hitting the alternator, as well as about 1/8" of the aluminum housing (vac area not the steel exhaust route). This all actually turned out to be a blessing, as I found that part of the diaphragm was pinched between the halves of the aluminum housing. I disassembled the wastegate nearly completely in order to clock the housing so the nipple wouldn't hit the alternator. A bit of grinding later and it fits fine.

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9794.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9802.jpg

Wastegate ground. Please ignore the funky old welds on the manifold.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9813.jpg

If only all my cuts were perfect then all the welds would look like this:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9800.jpg

Fits now!
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9808.jpg

[Viper_ed]

Welds look like crap, but you get my respect!!! I love when people tackle new things themselves instead of just writing a check.

At the end of the day you can step back and be proud of what you have done! :awsome:

[sutyak]

Welds look like crap, but you get my respect!!! I love when people tackle new things themselves instead of just writing a check.

At the end of the day you can step back and be proud of what you have done! :awsome:
You're right, the welds don't look like they are from someone who was paid to do it. However, I assure you they are solid and are penetrating well. My cuts are really what are bad. There were some rather large gaps I had to span. If you can span a 1/4" gap with a 110v MIG welder (.025 wire 100% CO2) and it look perfect, then you are the man. I don't have any saw specific for tube cutting, so literally every joint is going to have a slight gap due to a flat cut mating to a curved surface.
If you're talking specifically about the manifold, then yes it looks simply awful. It has been cut/ground/rewelded in a few problem spots probably 5 times. I determined it was stress cracks from a warped flange. Hopefully that has been resolved.
Looking at some of my old welds that look like they just sit on top of the pipe I think it's a miracle they have held, but they have for 5 years.

That reply was too wordy. I should have just said fu my welds are great. :sticktonge:

I do appreciate the DIY complement. People really take for granted how much R&D goes into the products they pay for.

[mr4teth]

That reply was too wordy. I should have just said fu my welds are great. :sticktonge:



I concur! Very cool project!

[sutyak]

All welding done and parts painted. I paint my welded exhaust parts to keep them from rusting too quickly. Some of my welds from 5 years ago had not rusted yet after painting them. Painted with 1200* grill paint and cured on the grill. The only thing left in Phase 1 should be routing the water lines, mounting everything and checking out the tune. I hope to wrap up tomorrow/Wednesday.

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9816.jpg

[Martin0660]

What is that big oval shaped thing in the lower right? LOL ;)

[wick]

What is that big oval shaped thing in the lower right? LOL ;)

A potato cooker??

[sutyak]

A potato cooker??


What is that big oval shaped thing in the lower right? LOL ;)

Rofl. I try to ruffle as few feathers as possible while still have fun with my car. I can always weld in a dump pipe or "test pipe" :) for the track. I also daily drive it and take it on long trips when possible. The Freestyle has taken over as the primary vehicle since the kiddos came along.

[sutyak]

Turbo is on and no apparent oil, coolant or exhaust leaks. Tomorrow after work I'll do some datalogging and adjust the tune as necessary. I didn't get a chance to drive it today, just let it idle up to temp to check for leaks.

[sutyak]

The turbo is on and spooling and running fine with zero leaks. This is actually the first time my car has not had exhaust leaking from somewhere.
The bad news is the wastegate spring is only 6psi instead of 8psi, so it wasn't a very exciting drive. The tune is overly rich since dropping from 11psi to 6psi, but I'll touch that up a bit until I get a new spring or boost controller. More pics to follow.

Next project is the house, not the car so it will be some time before I get back to it.

[sutyak]

I believe I determined I have a 7.2psi spring in the wastegate. I had the spring out twice and I'm fairly certain it was green. HERE is the guide from Tial (http://www.tialmedia.com/documents/w3_tial_38_sp.pdf). I would have sworn the boost gauge didn't go above 6 though, but I guess I was trying to watch a lot of things a the same time.
I'm not sure if I'll go with the 8.7psi or the 10.1psi spring. Probably the 10.1psi...

Installed photos:

Without manifold heat shield
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9826.jpg

With manifold heat shield (modified stock heat shield)
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9829.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9831.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9834.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9836.jpg

Sorry no decent under-car photos. I tried to take some tonight and it just didn't work out. Next time I'm under the car in the daylight I'll take some.

Overall I have to say I'm extremely happy with how smoothly the build went. I am also a firm believer in v-band clamps now!
I've only had it out for one drive to help dial in the tune, so I can't really comment yet on how fast the turbo spools etc. I should have more input after this weekend, and my also post data log info.

[Martin0660]

Very nice Mark

Do you have you gauge and wastegate working from the same reference point in the system or is there some difference?

For example ... getting your boost signal off the compressor housing and your boost gauge off the vacuum tree after the throttle body? If that's the case, the difference is the pressure drop across your intercooler for example.

On edit - I thought you said before, but I forget what do you use to tune?

[sutyak]

Very nice Mark

Do you have you gauge and wastegate working from the same reference point in the system or is there some difference?

For example ... getting your boost signal off the compressor housing and your boost gauge off the vacuum tree after the throttle body? If that's the case, the difference is the pressure drop across your intercooler for example.

On edit - I thought you said before, but I forget what do you use to tune?
Bob I think you hit the nail on the head my friend. The boost gauge is at the manifold and the wastegate reads directly from the compressor housing.
I tune with the SCT Pro Racer Package.

[Martin0660]

Good deal, then you can get a little more boost by changing your gate reference to the manifold or swapping spirings as you discussed.

That's not a bad drop across the intercooler, but it will likely go up as you increase flow.

There is merit to both control points, I personally like my gate referenced to the manifold so that I'm tuning to a manifold pressure. The upside of referencing compresser pressure is knowing where the turbo really is on the map.

[sutyak]

Good deal, then you can get a little more boost by changing your gate reference to the manifold or swapping spirings as you discussed.

That's not a bad drop across the intercooler, but it will likely go up as you increase flow.

There is merit to both control points, I personally like my gate referenced to the manifold so that I'm tuning to a manifold pressure. The upside of referencing compresser pressure is knowing where the turbo really is on the map.

Maybe you can help me decide then. I've never run a boost controller, so I'm not sure what psi spring to start with. My goal is to run 20-25psi with this turbo about this time next year. Now I need to choose a boost level I can have fun with but also make sure not to pop this motor. So will a boost controller be able to bleed off enough boost from an 8.7psi spring to make 25psi?

Perhaps I should buy the boost controller first and leave this current spring. That actually makes more sense after I type it out. I can ease up the psi until the MAF counts are right where they were with the IHI, which I knew was a safe pressure.

[sutyak]

I forgot to post pictures of the car. I figure most people here have never seen it.

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9824.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Focus/IMG_9477-1.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Focus/IMG_9478.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Focus/IMG_9479.jpg

[PaxtonShelby]

Looks nice!

I hope your house project is INSIDE!! HOLY CRAP - they're talking 100 degrees on Saturday...

[Martin0660]

I have to say Mark, I might not be the best opinion on this. It's been so long since I've used anything except an exceptional EBC (AMS 500). My controller references manifold pressure with a MAP sensor then uses solenoids on both sides of the waste gate to put it spot on set point. It's great control, but not cheap. With that, I am limited to a little over 2:1 on manifold pressure (ran 10# spring, max 25 psi manifold pressure) I've gone to a 15 psi spring lately.

When I ran manual, with a 10 psi spring I was also roughly limited to 25 psi. I think control is best at 2:1, but guys are running a lot more with manual controllers.

I have played with a few other guys cars with manuals lately and to be honest they frustrate me after knowing what I have. You get into spikes and drop off.

In my Precision gate I can stack springs so I could go to 30 in the gate if I needed to. If I didn't have my controller, I would likely use springs.

As I started with, my opinion is rather skewed after I learned what good boost control really is ;) lots of rambling here, not sure if it helps.

[sutyak]

I have to say Mark, I might not be the best opinion on this. It's been so long since I've used anything except an exceptional EBC (AMS 500). My controller references manifold pressure with a MAP sensor then uses solenoids on both sides of the waste gate to put it spot on set point. It's great control, but not cheap. With that, I am limited to a little over 2:1 on manifold pressure (ran 10# spring, max 25 psi manifold pressure) I've gone to a 15 psi spring lately.

When I ran manual, with a 10 psi spring I was also roughly limited to 25 psi. I think control is best at 2:1, but guys are running a lot more with manual controllers.

I have played with a few other guys cars with manuals lately and to be honest they frustrate me after knowing what I have. You get into spikes and drop off.

In my Precision gate I can stack springs so I could go to 30 in the gate if I needed to. If I didn't have my controller, I would likely use springs.

As I started with, my opinion is rather skewed after I learned what good boost control really is ;) lots of rambling here, not sure if it helps.

Yes that does help! I'm not sure I'll need the AMS 500 after Googling it, but it's good to know about it. This is what i was considering: TurboSmart Dual Stage Mechanical Boost Controller (http://www.topspeedparts.com/TurboSmart-Dual-Stage-Mechanical-Boost-Controller-Black_p_733.html).

[sutyak]

Looks nice!

I hope your house project is INSIDE!! HOLY CRAP - they're talking 100 degrees on Saturday...

Partly inside. So many projects lined up it's insane. Next up is replacing windows in the basement, then completely remodeling the downstairs bathroom, more car stuff, then walling up a room into the basement. This is what you get with a house built in 1919 and not remodeled since the 80's. :D

[sutyak]

I'm going to get a vac block and use the large vac port on the manifold that used to connect to the evap solenoid.
I purchased a TurboSmart dual stage mechanical boost controller so I can work my way up to 10-12psi.

I updated the overly rich 12psi IHI tune last night and loaded up the leaner tune today. The tun is basically dead on now where I want it (11.0-ish AF) in WOT. The only timing the knock sensor pulled was actually between shifts. I think that is due to needing to reset the IAC as the RPMs are hanging a bit.
At 7psi the log is showing 790 MAF counts. The max MAF counts at 12psi with the IHI was 880, so the GT2871r certainly seems to be flowing more air.

The spool time is great, and the respool time is even better. I'd say the GT is basically the same spool time as the IHI. I'm not sure how since the IHI is such a smaller AR turbine, but I'm not complaining. :D

[phillysrt4]

absolutely cool project! I've been a fan of the 2871 (as well as the 3071 and 3076) for quite a while. Total respect on having the gear to fabricate it yourself. I'm looking forward to seeing updates both on the build and tuning progress.

[sutyak]

Thanks for the kudos, phillysrt4!

This is the boost controller I went with:
http://www.turbosmartusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Product_dualstage.jpg (http://www.turbosmartusa.com/product/dual-stage)

I bought it open-box from ebay, so I wanted to make certain it wasn't busted up so I took it apart. This is what is inside. This one is indeed new.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120711_084815.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120711_084855.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120711_084836.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120711_085304.jpg

For those wondering how this works, it is a bleed-off type boost controller. That means it will bleed off a preset amount of air going to the wastegate.
This controller has two stages of bleed-off, controlled by a switch. The only electronic part in this system is the solenoid that opens the path to the second bleed dial. It appears it would work fine as a single-stage without any 12v signal.

The dials are reverse threaded. Turning counter-clockwise closes the bleeder valves. Turning clockwise opens the bleeder valves to increase boost.

I have not installed this yet. I ordered a vacuum block and it won't be here until later this week. I'm going to clean up some vac/boost lines so my boost gauge, boost controller and bov all get the signal from the same vac block.
I'm going backpacking/flyfishing for a few days next week, so don't expect any updates until after. :awsome:

[phillysrt4]

That does look mint. Good find.

I like where you're going with the vac line setup.

[sutyak]

I have the vac block (pics later) and now need vac/boost line. Any recommendations? I believe 6mm (.25in) is what I need.

[phillysrt4]

IIRC the vac/boost lines in my SRT were 6mm. You're running a similar turbo as far as flow (2871R vs a TD04R-"16G" stock, TD05R-15GK2 for S3) so I think you would be okay with that.

[phillysrt4]

As an aside, I'm really excited to see how this turbo performs on your car. My prediction is close to off-idle spoolup (my guess is 2200RPM) with nice power all the way through 6k. You're gonna have a really great compromise between stoplight-to-stoplight racing and having to wait until 2k before redline for your turbo to spool.

[sutyak]

IIRC the vac/boost lines in my SRT were 6mm. You're running a similar turbo as far as flow (2871R vs a TD04R-"16G" stock, TD05R-15GK2 for S3) so I think you would be okay with that.

Any particular brand van line you like?
The turbo should flow up to or past 7K rpm, going by other dyno charts I've seen.

[phillysrt4]

I don't have a brand pref. as the stockers that came with the SRT were adequate for all of my tinkering around.

My predictions were all off the cuff. I haven't looked at the 2871 map in a while (since I wrote my turbo article in the tech section). I also forgot that you're running 2 litres not 2.4 like the SRT.

[Martin0660]

If you are re-doing things and want to make them last, I really recomend good silicone hose. There are cheaper sources out there, but I like Treadstones stuff (and buy most of my coupler / clamps from them)

http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/product.phtml?p=1422&cat_key=469&prodname=Silicone+Vacuum+Hose

[PaxtonShelby]

Philly...that sig of yours is fantastic!!

[mr4teth]

Philly...that sig of yours is fantastic!! +1:bouncy:

[sutyak]

If you are re-doing things and want to make them last, I really recomend good silicone hose. There are cheaper sources out there, but I like Treadstones stuff (and buy most of my coupler / clamps from them)

http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/product.phtml?p=1422&cat_key=469&prodname=Silicone+Vacuum+Hose

Thanks Bob. I ended up buying from here right before you replied.
http://www.siliconeintakes.com/product_info.php?cPath=18&products_id=304&osCsid=83609be9f62e723fc01e5704ee6d9293

I had some 1/4 (6mm) ID fuel hose and determined I actually need 4mm.
I agree, nice sig Philly. :pinkthumb:

[phillysrt4]

Thanks for the sig comments!

On topic: Treadstone also has great pricing. they really are a win/win situation.

[sutyak]

I'm heavily considering mounting my boost controller in the car, in a console I've literally never used.
The distance of hose to it would be somewhere around 4-6 feet. Is this too far? I know my boost gauge line is further than that and it certainly seems instantaneous in its readings.
It would be far more convenient to be able to adjust the knobs in the car.
Thoughts?

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120713_091627.jpg

[phillysrt4]

If you saw the plumbing for the vac lines in the neon, you wouldn't worry about 6 feet :)

[sutyak]

If you saw the plumbing for the vac lines in the neon, you wouldn't worry about 6 feet :)

:laughing: Thanks man!

[sutyak]

I went ahead and mounted the boost controller. I'm still waiting on the silicone hose so nothing is hooked up yet.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9906.jpg

While looking for a good place to drill a hole in the firewall for the vacuum line I found a small miracle: a factory-plugged hole right where I wanted one! :pepper:
It's behind the glove box near where the A/C lines come through. I twisted a screw through to see where it popped out.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9899.jpg

See screw in the center of the photo:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9897.jpg

I also wrapped the turbo to help the underhood temp. I'll wrap the downpipe later. I hate to because I love the gloss black.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9902.jpg

[PaxtonShelby]

When your Focus was being born at the factory, there is no way it had any idea that it would be shown so much love. Keep up the good work!

[phillysrt4]

Its almost as if ford was going to run 6' of hose too :)

[sutyak]

Now THIS is more like it! :D Boost controller is now hooked up. I'm only running the stage 1 of the 2-stage boost controller until I drop in a built motor. Basically I didn't bother wiring up the switch yet that opens the second bleed-off valve.
I installed a 6-port vacuum block even though I only hooked up the boost controller tonight. I wanted to make sure I had enough 4mm silicone hose to route the boost controller before re-routing the BOV and boost gauge. Eventually the BOV, meth injection, boost gauge and boost controller will be routed off the same vac block.
The boost is now set around 9psi (vs. 6-ish psi previously). Just moving the boost source from the compressor housing to the vac block bumped it to ~8psi. A couple clockwise clicks of the boost controller set it to 9psi.
Tomorrow I'll do some datalogging to dial in the AF and timing more carefully. AF looked good tonight but I also didn't really run it hard. I just wanted to check peak boost.

Vac block (bought from Amazon)
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9912.jpg

Boost controller T. This contains a spring and ball to decrease spool time, but it also causes a momentary 1psi boost spike. So far I consider it a fair tradeoff.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9917.jpg

The port behind the glovebox that Ford so kindly put there for me
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9921.jpg

4mm silicone hose routed to boost controller
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_9924.jpg

[Martin0660]

Really sweet Mark! Glad it's all coming together.

[sutyak]

Really sweet Mark! Glad it's all coming together.

Thanks Bob!
You've been a huge help to me over the past few years. I appreciate all the insight you have provided.:awsome:

[phillysrt4]

looks like you're not too far off from hitting a dyno now :) I cant wait to see that "instant on" torque :)

[sutyak]

looks like you're not too far off from hitting a dyno now :) I cant wait to see that "instant on" torque :)

Perhaps if there were any close I would. PRP is closer than any dyno.

I forgot to mention I bought a water-methanol injection kit from another turbo Focus owner. I'm going to do some bench testing and make sure I fully understand the kit, how to adjust it, flow rates and spray patters before I hook it up. I'm definitely looking forward to keeping those intake temps down and being able to bump up the timing a bit. :jump:

[Martin0660]

I'm definitely looking forward to keeping those intake temps down and being able to bump up the timing a bit. :jump:

I'm curious to see your results. I've been of the opinion that a turbo somewhere on a decent efficiency island, decent intercoolin, and a good tune, that you are further ahead without the water / methanol.

In the 2.3 world I see lots of people talking about how high their boost and timing are with it, but in reality similar combos with more sane timing are making the same power. I'm just not convinced the gains outweigh the losses unless you are pushing a turbo, lacking intercooling, or have some other limitation (octane limited).

Looking forward to your opinion when you start to use it :awsome:

[sutyak]

I'm curious to see your results. I've been of the opinion that a turbo somewhere on a decent efficiency island, decent intercoolin, and a good tune, that you are further ahead without the water / methanol.

In the 2.3 world I see lots of people talking about how high their boost and timing are with it, but in reality similar combos with more sane timing are making the same power. I'm just not convinced the gains outweigh the losses unless you are pushing a turbo, lacking intercooling, or have some other limitation (octane limited).

Looking forward to your opinion when you start to use it :awsome:

It's tough to argue against a cooler air charge and increased octane. I will most definitely share my results.

I turned the boost up to 10-11psi and tuned it tonight then turned the boost down one click. This type of boost controller doesn't hold rock steady; it slowly floats +/- .5psi at peak boost. I knew that might be the case when I went with the bleed-off type boost controller. It doesn't particularly seem to be a problem. This might be the result of the ball/spring setup in the "T".
MAF counts are peaking out around 900 at 6500 RPM at 10psi. That's 20 counts up vs. the 12psi of the IHI turbo. It's safe to say this flows a higher CFM. :D

[Tony71502]

I'm not an expert by no means. I have never had a boosted engine. But from what I have seen... Loss of PSI is not a bad thing. One guy added A2A to his kenne bell on a fox 5.0. He lost 3 PSI because of the intercooler, but gained 100 horses.

School me if you know more. I know about fluid dynamics, but not turbos/supers or their setudps.

[sutyak]

Now what could this be for?

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_20120804_195506.jpg

(40% off with coupon code A123 at Advance Auto :jump:)

5 parts HEET to 1 gal PEAK -20* brand washer fluid should be about 55% methanol / 45% water.
I haven't found a local place to buy straight methanol to make my own mix so this will have to do.

[billyNOTnice]

nice build!

[sutyak]

nice build!

Thanks!

In the process of relocating the power steering reservoir to make room for the new intake manifold. Going to tap into the intake manifold for the WMI nozzle, and also putting the IAT in the intake manifold. Expect a lot of detailed pictures. :awsome:

[sutyak]

Working towards getting the intake manifold installed. Unfortunately in order to make room for the manifold I had to swap power steering pumps for an older style and use the older style power steering reservoir. Due to my unconventional turbo setup I couldn't mount the power steering reservoir in the stock location, so I just made a bracket. I mounted the reservoir as high as possible. It's hard to believe the hood clears it, but it does.

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0200.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0198.jpg

Old style (2003-2005?) vs. new style with integrated reservoir (2006+)
The only difference is the tube
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0196.jpg

[sutyak]

Finally time for an update. I had quite the tuning issue where the PCM wasn't providing fuel after installing the new intake manifold. See solution here: Adjusting tune for aftermarket Duratec IM (http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=287014)

All is well now and the car screams again. Tom pointed out that my timing was way too low, and it was so that certainly woke the car up. I don't recall why I had my timing jacked so low but that's fixed.

I installed a Cossie knock-off intake manifold. I would ONLY recommend these to someone willing to do some clean-up work with a die grinder. The horns for the intake runners were a mess and there were bits of aluminum that needed removed for fear of them coming off and being sucked into the engine. Also, save yourself some hassle and do not buy one of these manifolds that someone painted already. What a pain that was.
Overall I do like the manifold. Nothing lost down-low on my 2.0 and wakes it up more up-top. What I do not like is the MAJOR heat-soak this thing gets from the head. On a 70* day the intake temps will be around 90-100* while driving. After sitting at idle the temps will climb to 140-150*!! A future project is making an intake spacer, probably just out of silicone.

I also installed a methanol injection kit with a 2gph nozzle. I have it set to come on about 6psi. Max boost right now is 11psi. Intake temps drop almost 30* after it kicks in, and the AFR drops a solid point. I am not running any additional timing. The mix is approximately 50/50 water/meth mixing 1 gallon of -20* PEAK brand washer fluid with 4 bottles of HEET.

At the same time I swapped out the 55# injectors for some 60# to have some head room for the future build.


Intake manifold details:
- The oil dip stick will have to be bent
- The bottom bolts will be a royal pain to get in
- The IAC has to be mounted upside-down in relation to stock
- The IAC bolt nearest to the throttle body will need ground down so the throttle body does not hit it while opening
- When adjusting the tune, see link above. I did not disable the IMRC in the tune.
- The brake booster fitting doesn't fit. Remove it, go to the hardware store and buy the necessary fittings for a 3/8" line. Sorry I don't know the thread size. I already had it.
- Expect a lot of cleaning up on the inside of the Cossie knock-off. Sorry no before and after pictures
- You will lose cruise control because the cruise control clip will come in contact with the IAC bolt. I'm still working on a solution.
- For a 2.0 it does require the older style power steering pump and reservoir
- Trim and reuse the 1/8" fuel pressure sensor hose. Also use a properly sized 1/4 NPT with 1/8" outlet. The FPS seemed a bit sensitive while tuning. I used a smaller diameter hose initially which messed with the pressure readings.
- Expect the throttle bracket to not fit exactly right on the knock-off brand

The IAC bolt that needs ground down. (this is after grinding and it barely clears)
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0273.jpg

Manifold installed. I put an IAT sensor in the removable panel
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0263.jpg

Bottom view. PCV plugged. WMI nozzle installed.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0230.jpg

IAT sensor grommet installed. I did not use that brake booster fitting in the photo. I also swapped out that little vac nipple for larger one for the FPS
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0228.jpg

View of where the WMI nozzle sprays into the manifold. It is directly after the throttle body. Note: this requires a one-way check valve in the WMI line.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0233.jpg

Hood clearance of IAT sensor, for those who are curious
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0255.jpg

WMI tank and pump
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0257.jpg

After panel replaced and stickers applied :)
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMAG0059_zps4c61612f.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMAG0057_zps8d3f860e.jpg

Hoses run out a pre-existing vent in the hatch
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0260.jpg

Hood clearance for power steering reservoir
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0254.jpg

Vac block all hooked up
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMG_0269.jpg

That's all the progress to report for now. I doubt there will be anything else major going on in 2012. I've worked on it so much that I just want to drive it now.
I do have some cheapy seats that I may put in this year. (they were free)

[somethingclever]

great job and clean installs every Mark...

maybe I missed the new hp numbers or track mph?

[sutyak]

great job and clean installs every Mark...

maybe I missed the new hp numbers or track mph?

Need to get the slicks mounted then I'll be ready for the track. I doubt I'll get it dyno'd before the new motor goes in.
Datalogs show much better flow at the same psi and that's good enough for me.

[sutyak]

More recent photos:

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMAG0072.jpg

Brake booster. I also installed a 3/8" check valve that is not pictured.
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMAG0076.jpg

And finally my "beta" solution to the cruise control, since I'll be taking a 5-hour trip this weekend:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee320/sporadicmach/Turbo/IMAG0065.jpg

[Martin0660]

Nice Mark! Keep it coming