teh 5.0 is running like crap

[J-rod]

started yesterday morning. it was running really rough, exhaust sounded different, and at a stop, idle, it began shaking....i thought it was cuz i was low on gas. put gas in it and still the same. it feels even lower on power than it is. the idle surges, and i can feel it surging at part throttle. i just changed plugs,wires,cap,rotor, last saturday and it drove great up until yesterday morning.

i have a new fuel filter here, just need to get the fuel line tool to swap it out.

could this be a fuel issue? i was thinking it maybe an air intake/vacuum problem but only thing i disconected was the MAF meter and plugged it back in. maybe a vac plug came off from where the smog pump was disabled. :dunno: if it is a fuel issue has anyone used the seafoam stuff in the gas tank as a fuel system cleaner? ive used it for the crankcase but not fuel system. any other brand like better?

[scott5]

all your plug wires on completely?

[J-rod]

all your plug wires on completely?


yep....triple checked it last night before the ER.

[blkp42e]

TPS sensor

[scott5]

TPS sensor

yea.. that maybe it

[madmaxin22]

dont need the fuel line clip tool, just two small screwdrivers....any vacuum lines come off when you did your tune up??

[J-rod]

dont need the fuel line clip tool, just two small screwdrivers....any vacuum lines come off when you did your tune up??


hmm looked like the tool was needed.

anyways yea i lost a screw that was capping something, but i got a new screw and capped it all....like i said it ran great from saturday-tuesday night. :dunno:

it was the plugs i have circled here. they were capped and i had to recap one. i think that is smog related. :dunno: im still learning the 5.0

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c267/jcvince17/smog.jpg

[coralcoupe1993]

Did you ever change your fuel pump? I have to do that with every FOX I get. I will have a 155lph for sale soon if you want it. It has about 3500 miles on it.

[J-rod]

Did you ever change your fuel pump? I have to do that with every FOX I get. I will have a 155lph for sale soon if you want it. It has about 3500 miles on it.


nope i havent done anything to the fuel system yet. i have a fuel filter ready to go in.

[coralcoupe1993]

nope i havent done anything to the fuel system yet. i have a fuel filter ready to go in.

I had to cycle the key in the vert 3 times before it would build presure when I first got it.

[J-rod]

I had to cycle the key in the vert 3 times before it would build presure when I first got it.


ive never had a problem with anything until yesterday morning/

[coralcoupe1993]

ive never had a problem with anything until yesterday morning/

Most of mine just went over night.

[J-rod]

Most of mine just went over night.

so i now have 3 possibilities

1. fuel pump - ~70-100+
2. TPS - $35
3. IAC - $75

:o

[blkp42e]

id try TPS 1st

[coralcoupe1993]

Test the voltage of the TPS before you take it off. It may be off. I had one that was way over a volt and it did the same thing.

[J-rod]

Test the voltage of the TPS before you take it off. It may be off.


how :dunno:

and whats it supposed to read?

[coralcoupe1993]

how :dunno:

and whats it supposed to read?


Between 0.8 and 1.0 V.

Key on test one of the wires going to it with a volt meter.

[J-rod]

Between 0.8 and 1.0 V.

Key on test one of the wires going to it with a volt meter.

will do tomorrow. :goodidea: (raining now and steph is pissed at me so i need to go home and be good.) lol

[coralcoupe1993]

Yea, if it makes you feel better, the drop is running like crap too. On my way in to work today it was dropping power between 2-3k rpms.

[wick]

Did you ever change your fuel pump? I have to do that with every FOX I get. I will have a 155lph for sale soon if you want it. It has about 3500 miles on it.


Thought that was going to me.

Jarad, do you have a check engine light on?

[J-rod]

Jarad, do you have a check engine light on?

negative


no CEL here

edit - spell my name right fool. :balls1:

[wick]

negative


no CEL here


It wont be any of your sensors then. They would trigger a light. I would say fuel pump or fuel filter. Get a fuel pressure gauge and test that. A filter is easy to change. If it was your TPS, it would send a code for low voltage or high voltage. I, like colin, would lean toward a fuel delivery issue.

[wick]

edit - spell my name right fool. :balls1:


HAHAHAHAHAHAHA Sorry bro.

[J-rod]

It wont be any of your sensors then. They would trigger a light. I would say fuel pump or fuel filter. Get a fuel pressure gauge and test that. A filter is easy to change. If it was your TPS, it would send a code for low voltage or high voltage. I, like colin, would lean toward a fuel delivery issue.

i have the filter in the building waiting to go on. maybe ill get my buddy to bring his jack over and swap it out tomorrow. :goodidea:

[wick]

i have the filter in the building waiting to go on. maybe ill get my buddy to bring his jack over and swap it out tomorrow. :goodidea:


Good idea. I must ask, is the bulb in the dash for the CEL? Does it come on when you turn the key on and then go off when you start it up?

[J-rod]

Good idea. I must ask, is the bulb in the dash for the CEL? Does it come on when you turn the key on and then go off when you start it up?


yes it does. :)


what lph is a stock fuel pump?

[blkp42e]

90 or something

[J-rod]

90 or something


what would happen if you put in a larger pump and stock 19# injectors?


also i noticed my volt gauge seemed to be running low on the way home. i did have the radio,wipers,lights on....and its the stock 75a so maybe its normal...i turned the lights/wipers off and it climbed back up some. so i think thats normal...

i been thinking fuel anywyas.

[J-rod]

i see LMM has 155 lph for sale same price advance has the stock ones.

just wonder if i should go pick it up or not. :dunno:

[blkp42e]

get a 155 for further mods

[INSANELY CRAZY]

i see LMM has 155 lph for sale same price advance has the stock ones.

just wonder if i should go pick it up or not. :dunno:

big no-no /advance = JUNK!!!

i always went with the 190 from lmm.. always did me good

[coralcoupe1993]

LMM will work or even summit. I typicaly call Summit and haggle (they can see what I have purchased in the past :slaphappy: ) Stay away from the big parts vendors that crap doesnt work - tried it before. Dont worry about going big, the system has a return, you will not run rich or anything like that. Differnt that a carb set up! :highfive:

[J-rod]

LMM will work or even summit. I typicaly call Summit and haggle (they can see what I have purchased in the past :slaphappy: ) Stay away from the big parts vendors that crap doesnt work - tried it before. Dont worry about going big, the system has a return, you will not run rich or anything like that. Differnt that a carb set up! :highfive:

awesome!! should i pay the extra $20 for 190?

[J-rod]

anyone wanna come down and help me do an install? :)

wick? :goodidea:
:rotflol:

[coralcoupe1993]

anyone wanna come down and help me do an install? :)

wick? :goodidea:
:rotflol:

Go for a 190. It isnt that hard, the 1st time it kind of sucks.

[J-rod]

Go for a 190. It isnt that hard, the 1st time it kind of sucks.


i dont have a jack...all mine were too high for the stang.

my dad is thinking its not a fuel pump. said cuz normally the either work or they dont. no in between. :dunno:

[wick]

Its a pump. They go bad. Coral can tell you. He has the worst luck. Perhaps he and I can take a trip on Saturday. He is a whiz at doing them.:laughing1:

[J-rod]

Its a pump. They go bad. Coral can tell you. He has the worst luck. Perhaps he and I can take a trip on Saturday. He is a whiz at doing them.:laughing1:

:woot1: lmk guys....ill fry up some wings and beer (even though dr. says no.)

ill drive up to LMM and get a pump if need be

[J-rod]

this thing any good.
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?cat=Tools+%26+Equipment&pid=00902179000&vertical=AUTO&BV_UseBVCookie=Yes

[383taman]

I agree with jared dad bad or good in most cases check your fuel pressure before you buy anything.sounds to me like a bad plug wire. Maybe one got burt on the header.:yes:

[J-rod]

I agree with jared dad bad or good in most cases check your fuel pressure before you buy anything.sounds to me like a bad plug wire. Maybe one got burt on the header.:yes:


definately a NO there....i got FMS wires with FMS wire looms bolted to the valve covers....these things arent close to the headers at all. :awsome:

ill snap a pic in the daylight

[coralcoupe1993]

I agree with jared dad bad or good in most cases check your fuel pressure before you buy anything.:yes:

Good point but I would sugest changing that thing either way!:pinkthumb:

[madmaxin22]

fuel pump swap is pretty easy... hardest part is finagling the pump/sender back into the tank....hope you dont have a full tank of gas!!!

[383taman]

Maybe broke plug putting it in?

[wick]

Maybe broke plug putting it in?


But it ran fine for a few days then all of a sudden, BAM, it runs like shit.

[J-rod]

But it ran fine for a few days then all of a sudden, BAM, it runs like shit.


:yes:

[J-rod]

hope you dont have a full tank of gas!!!


nope im good there...down to 1/4 :goodidea:

[383taman]

Yea i would check fuel pressure first rather than just put a pump in it that all im saying.Be a mad if i bought a pump and that dont fix it.

[J-rod]

Yea i would check fuel pressure first rather than just put a pump in it that all im saying.Be a mad if i bought a pump and that dont fix it.


im gonna get a gauge tomorrow.....right now im going to bed....im in a TON of pain.

later scs

[383taman]

Hope u feel better buddy.

[blkp42e]

Im still saying TPS

[RUSH2112]

what would happen if you put in a larger pump and stock 19# injectors?


also i noticed my volt gauge seemed to be running low on the way home. i did have the radio,wipers,lights on....and its the stock 75a so maybe its normal...i turned the lights/wipers off and it climbed back up some. so i think thats normal...

i been thinking fuel anywyas.

I got a 255lph on my stock injectors. Runs fine. :pinkthumb:

[RUSH2112]

Its a pump. They go bad. Coral can tell you. He has the worst luck. Perhaps he and I can take a trip on Saturday. He is a whiz at doing them.:laughing1:

I replaced my pump a few months ago. Surprisingly it was pretty easy. I have very detailed instructions, with pictures if your interested.

[J-rod]

I replaced my pump a few months ago. Surprisingly it was pretty easy. I have very detailed instructions, with pictures if your interested.


ive done a couple...just never alone...and i dont have a jack here....i need to get one that will fit under the GT. :rolleyes:

[RUSH2112]

ive done a couple...just never alone...and i dont have a jack here....i need to get one that will fit under the GT. :rolleyes:

I have a TPS if you need one

[RUSH2112]

ive done a couple...just never alone...and i dont have a jack here....i need to get one that will fit under the GT. :rolleyes:

Call a friend. It is defintely easier with 2 people, especiallly when you start dropping the tank and have to get it off the neck part.

[J-rod]

Call a friend. It is defintely easier with 2 people, especiallly when you start dropping the tank and have to get it off the neck part.

he never calls back unless there is women involved...but now he has a GF so he never calls back. lol



I have a TPS if you need one

ill let ya know.

[RUSH2112]

he never calls back unless there is women involved...but now he has a GF so he never calls back. lol

For beer, I'm anyone's friend :laughing1: :pepper:

[J-rod]

another buddy of mine called and said check the stock FPR as well and it might have jumped time? :dunno:

i have to go try and buy a fuel pressure gauge tomorrow...thought i could borrow one but it hasnt worked out.

[wick]

Its almost impossible to jump time. I have never seen this happen. Only with fiber gears, not a double roller timing chain.The FPG you woer looking at is the same one I have with the drain hose on it. Works great. I am still leaning to a weak pump or plugged filter. How does it drive now?

[J-rod]

Its almost impossible to jump time. I have never seen this happen. Only with fiber gears, not a double roller timing chain.The FPG you woer looking at is the same one I have with the drain hose on it. Works great. I am still leaning to a weak pump or plugged filter. How does it drive now?



drives the same...im gogin to advance now and getting a gauge.

[INSANELY CRAZY]

if you can hear your pump wining while your driving or at idle then it's goin bad.. usually when they go bad they will pressurize then you will hear it solid wine (can be loud)

[J-rod]

i think i might have found the problem.......heading to building to get my tools

[J-rod]

this is all smog related right.....everything looked capped off? while changing plugs i knocked a screw out, but replaced it.....look ok?

[wick]

Dont know why you have a bolt in the one, there is nothing on the other side.

[wick]

What do you think the problem is? The other two that are capped off go to the smog pump diaframs. Your good there. The other one goes to the back of the intake and the short one obviosly goes to the EGR.

[J-rod]

well i thought i found it. my #7 plug had worked itself loose somehow. i pulled it, checked it, put it back in. fired it up...idled nice....went for a drive around the block. and the surging is back..now i popped the hood while it was running and the motor is obvioulsy shaking....not normally either.

edit - any way to check codes on a OBDI system? even though i have no CEL light on.

[J-rod]

wick - ill take that pulley next time we meet up.

[wick]

edit - any way to check codes on a OBDI system? even though i have no CEL light on.

There is a way with a multi meter but I cant remember it. Its easier to spend a couple bucks and get the code scanner from advance.

[Balaska347]

If the car is still missing check to make sure that you don't have any moisture under the distributer cap also I would check the plug wires. Check them with ohms of resistance not just buy looking at them. The lower the resistance the better and they should all be pretty close like around 2 ohms. If you have any high ones like 10 ohms or more I would say its bad. Also if it say open line then the wire is broke inside.

Always check before you buy new parts.

[J-rod]

There is a way with a multi meter but I cant remember it. Its easier to spend a couple bucks and get the code scanner from advance.


thought the scanners were only for OBDII systems


If the car is still missing check to make sure that you don't have any moisture under the distributer cap also I would check the plug wires. Check them with ohms of resistance not just buy looking at them. The lower the resistance the better and they should all be pretty close like around 2 ohms. If you have any high ones like 10 ohms or more I would say its bad. Also if it say open line then the wire is broke inside.

Always check before you buy new parts.


my plugs, wires, cap, rotor are all only 7 days old. :dunno:

it ran fine up until wednesday mornign. im doing the fuel filter right now.

[madmaxin22]

i would go over everything you did on that tune up,, check the brass tabs on the underside of the cap, check the rotor tip.. hell, even pull the plugs and look at them and see if one is wet from not fireing or if they all look the same, look the wires over good... worth checking it all out before throwing parts at the car... check your FP yet?? can you hear the pump come on for a second when you turn the key to the foward position???

[J-rod]

i would go over everything you did on that tune up,, check the brass tabs on the underside of the cap, check the rotor tip.. hell, even pull the plugs and look at them and see if one is wet from not fireing or if they all look the same, look the wires over good... worth checking it all out before throwing parts at the car... check your FP yet?? can you hear the pump come on for a second when you turn the key to the foward position???


im sure its not a plug/cap/rotor problem. it ran GREAT for 4 days...then bam...terrible.

yes i can hear the pump working.

no i havent checked the FP yet...waiting till finish the fuel filter. i already had the filter here so decided to throw it on before paying $40 for a FP gauge...to maybe find out its the filter.

[J-rod]

fuel filter is on....and it is the same. added some FI cleaner and i need to give it time to run through.

where is the schreader valve to test FP on the fuel rail? i must be over looking it.

im leaning toward TPS or IAC or vac leak now myself....its acting like my old 98 GT did when the IAC went bad. but i didnt think the IAC was involved except for idle.

[383taman]

Right on the iac but checking for a vac leak get a can of carb cleaner and spray the motor down and see if the idle changes if it does find the area that changes and find your vac leak


fuel filter is on....and it is the same. added some FI cleaner and i need to give it time to run through.

where is the schreader valve to test FP on the fuel rail? i must be over looking it.

im leaning toward TPS or IAC or vac leak now myself....its acting like my old 98 GT did when the IAC went bad. but i didnt think the IAC was involved except for idle.

[J-rod]

i hate wasting money.....:doh:

[383taman]

Dont,find the problem then spend money on the part 2 fix it.

i hate wasting money.....:doh:

[J-rod]

Dont,find the problem then spend money on the part 2 fix it.


sill got to buy either carb cleaner or fp gauge :goodidea:

[383taman]

True wish i was close i would figure out you problem 4 you so you could just buy what it takes to fix it.:pepper:


sill got to buy either carb cleaner or fp gauge :goodidea:

[J-rod]

True wish i was close i would figure out you problem 4 you so you could just buy what it takes to fix it.:pepper:

i have beer! and ill get wings :goodidea:

[One Sweet Day]

Jared if you are coming up to meet Mike give me a call, maybe I can drop off your window!:goodidea: If not its no big deal to me...doesn't take up much room.:)

[J-rod]

ok....what does the TPS have to do with it surging? iac is for idle only...and its surging there too but the iac has nothing to do with the part throttle surging i am experiencing.

[J-rod]

I have a TPS if you need one

how much? you 100% positive it works?

[383taman]

If i wasnt so busy this weekend i would come help u out.


i have beer! and ill get wings :goodidea:

[Balaska347]

The valve for the fuel psi is on the line coming up in front of the passanger side head. It is before the fuel rail.

[J-rod]

The valve for the fuel psi is on the line coming up in front of the passanger side head. It is before the fuel rail.


yea i found it after i followed the fuel rail down

[J-rod]

anyone ever heard of the stock fuel pressure regulator going bad?

do you need to remove the intake to replace it.

[madmaxin22]

jared, do you have a cold air kit?? does your MAF only bolt up one way on a bracket like stock to the strut tower?... or can you rotate it and position in different ways???

[J-rod]

jared, do you have a cold air kit?? does your MAF only bolt up one way on a bracket like stock to the strut tower?... or can you rotate it and position in different ways???


i have a CAI. it isnt rotated... i removed the CAI in one piece to do the tune-up. :dunno: ill go double check and make sure it cant be rotated.

edit - here is pics. by my finger in pic 2 you can see a bolt. it goes up into the MAF housing.

[madmaxin22]

i've heard alot of ppl having idle surge etc from the maf being clocked at a weird position... check your maf sensor and make sure a hunk of dirt didnt get stuck on the maf element..... i dont know, just throwing out some ideas and brainstorming... know what its like to have a problem and have no clue whats wrong

[J-rod]

no i appreciate the ideas. :)

[wick]

If the car is still missing check to make sure that you don't have any moisture under the distributer cap also I would check the plug wires. Check them with ohms of resistance not just buy looking at them. The lower the resistance the better and they should all be pretty close like around 2 ohms. If you have any high ones like 10 ohms or more I would say its bad. Also if it say open line then the wire is broke inside.

Always check before you buy new parts.


I thought they were supposed to be 1000 ohms per foot.

[J-rod]

anyone ever heard of the stock fuel pressure regulator going bad?

do you need to remove the intake to replace it.


:dunno:

[INSANELY CRAZY]

:dunno:

yes they go bad... you gauge it yet?

you can do it with the intake on but it's crammed for space. makes it easier to remove it

[J-rod]

yes they go bad... you gauge it yet?

you can do it with the intake on but it's crammed for space. makes it easier to remove it


trying to find a gauge to borrow...if i dont find one today ill buy one tomorrow. i have read about people testing with the vac on and vac off. which vac line to i need to remove? or just say fugg it and test it as is. just tap into the schrader valve and turn key to run? i dont actually start the car do i?

[INSANELY CRAZY]

yea you can test vac line on/off but you need that gauge to see what pressure is..

yea start the car check it at idle

[J-rod]

yea you can test vac line on/off but you need that gauge to see what pressure is..

yea start the car check it at idle

if i dont find a gauge ill go buy one.

advance and vatozone dont rent (loaner tool program) i just got of the phone with them. so....

[INSANELY CRAZY]

wow the autozone in uniontown rents... ofcourse not sure on the f/p gauges

prolly cause they are so cheap

[J-rod]

ours rents a lot of parts just not the fuel psi gauge

[J-rod]

well i went and talked to steph's uncle who is a mechanic and im 99% sure we have found the problem....but i wont say what it is cuz im too embarressed. i get enough crap on here already....dont need to give yall any ammo.

:balls1:

[madmaxin22]

10 page thread man.. you have to share if it does turn out to be the problem

[RUSH2112]

You shouldn't be embarrased. It is sad that people get crap for posting what they deem "obvious" issues, but for those who don't know or not as car savvy (myself included) I rely on people posting there problems as it might help me or someone else in the future with the same problem.

[J-rod]

well car is cooling down....i went back to work so before i leave ill fix the issue...i hope. (i been carrying my tools all week. lol)

[J-rod]

well the idle is much better...time to see how it drives. 90% fixed.

im going home now....i still have a 10% problem that i dont see a solution for with these FMS headers.......there that outta give a hint as to part of my problem

[Warriorblaze]

The lowest resistance plug wires I've seen are 40 ohms/foot. So a 24 inch plug wire would have 80 ohms of resistance. As long as they all are decently close, I wouldn't worry about any slight variation.

[madmaxin22]

there that outta give a hint as to part of my problem

wires burning on headers???

[J-rod]

well the #3 plug boot is toast. but i dont see any way to keep it from the header. FMS headers and FMS wires and FMS looms...and fitment issues :rolleyes:


any ideas?

[madmaxin22]

i bought the summit boot protectors... they have worked great


http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=SUM%2D350109&N=700+400304+115&autoview=sku

[J-rod]

ill probably have to get something like that. if i can find me one plug wire then i can buy a set of those.

[J-rod]

taped it up and seemed to help.

[383taman]

Nope already know and just glad you found it not me then there would have been.J/k


well i went and talked to steph's uncle who is a mechanic and im 99% sure we have found the problem....but i wont say what it is cuz im too embarressed. i get enough crap on here already....dont need to give yall any ammo.

:balls1:

[Warriorblaze]

Just pull a boot off your old wires and put it on the new wire. Problem solved.

[J-rod]

Just pull a boot off your old wires and put it on the new wire. Problem solved.


:balls1: i tried and ruined 3 old wires...

[INSANELY CRAZY]

taped it up and seemed to help.

did you use the great old WV chrome to tape it up (duct tape)...

lol j/k over 112 post for a wire layin on the header... ohwell guess thats why we have troubleshootinig

so it running good now?

[Balaska347]

I'm glad you got the problem fixed Jared.

[J-rod]

running better. madmax sent me a new wire today....will have it thursday...then ill put on some boot protectors.

[INSANELY CRAZY]

kewl... glad to hear

[J-rod]

what ya think of these boot covers? local and cheaper.



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advance - $67 for same thing :dunno:
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Ships in 1 business day (2.00 lbs.)http://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/App_Themes/PA/Images/upperleft.gifWarrantyhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gif1 Year Limited Warranty (http://www.partsamerica.com/Help/HelpCenterWarranty.aspx)http://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gifhttp://www.partsamerica.com/images/spaclear.gif


i hate autozone....but for the price difference....

doesnt advance price match?

[J-rod]

thanks for the wire madmaxin22. :woot1: got it yesterday.

im actually gonna run the old blue wire on there until i get those covers....dont wanna fry a perfectly good matching red FMS wire. :)