sutyak's turbo focus

[Dan B.]

glad you knew I meant BOV when i said wastegate ;) lol..

My blow off valve and wastegate are the same thing..........

[MrAudia]

Very cool build!

[sutyak]

Another productive evening. Purchasing the mazdaspeed downpipe was definitely a help. I had to modify it a decent amount to make it work, but it still saved me a lot of time. Before I bolt everything together I'll paint, bake, then wrap the downpipe. My welds aren't stainless, so they'll rust if I don't paint them. Tomorrow I'll make the dump tube.



Old vs. new. The old one wasn't pretty but it served me well and didn't leak. The new one is much lighter without the cat and fewer joints. Big difference in downpipe angles since the turbo is oriented differently, but without the cat there was plenty of room to work.

[sutyak]

My modified fuel rail just arrived. -6AN in and out for the future return fuel setup. Maybe a late summer or fall project?

[sutyak]

Finished the wastegate dump tube yesterday and painted it. Ran out of 1200° paint so I didn't do the downpipe yet. I really hate to have to paint them, but in a few months I'd hate the surface rust on the welds even more. The wastegate dumps right behind the crossmember.

[phillysrt4]

dibs on shotgun for the shakedown pass ;)

[sutyak]

While everyone else is playing with goats...

Now have a new A1000 pump, return fuel rail, and a spare (clean) fuel tank to sump. Just a few more pieces and I'll be ready for some real fueling. Probably late summer or fall project.

[JeffreyCole]

Holy cow that's a serious fuel setup man.

[sutyak]

Holy cow that's a serious fuel setup man.

I always want to know there is fuel for whatever psi I throw at it. Not that those poor two front tires won't be abused enough at 400whp. We'll see how they scream for mercy at 500-600whp.

[JeffreyCole]

That's enough fuel for a crap ton more than 600 lol

[sutyak]

That's enough fuel for a crap ton more than 600 lol

True! This particular FWD setup surely won't see over 600whp, though. I have no intent to put a cage in it. I never intended to put a little 200whp turbo in it either, though...

[sutyak]

The 3082R is in! The verdict is still out on whether I'll keep this slow-spooling monster. It makes only 10psi at 4K RPMs, and 20psi roughly 5K. I haven't logged it, I just took it out for a quick drive to see how it feels/sounds. Obviously after it has spooled up it's a beast, but I'll most definitely have to rev it to 8K to make it worthwhile.
Where normally the 2871R would spool and help in 5th gear at 3K (70mph), the 3082R makes it basically N/A at that range, which makes me a bit sad after enjoying that torque.
The exhaust is a bit louder with no cat and the 30R turbine housing, and it sounds amazing. I wasn't sure what to expect with the dumped wastegate. Holy crap is it loud!! It's a good thing it spools so slowly or else I think I'd get sound violation tickets left and right in town.
The H&R setup is nothing short of amazing. It's far stiffer than the Ford Racing setup, but under control. It doesn't bounce my car around the road, it just stays planted. The rebound is controlled very well.

I decided to make a quick startup/walkaround video of the car. Forgive me for the production quality; I don't have an HD camera yet. I also don't think it actually recorded half the frequency range of the exhaust. It is DEEP.

[SlowSix]

looks good. I'd like to see this car some day.

[phillysrt4]

Glad to get the report on the 82. I kind of suspected the spool was going to be really late due to the displacement you're working with, but I'm sure when it hits it hits hard! Are you able to consistently spin the motor to 8k to take advantage of it? Can you adjust your cams to help with the spoolup?

As someone who's done the turbo 4banger FWD thing I completely relate to the quandary you have between these two turbos I think this quote says it all:

Where normally the 2871R would spool and help in 5th gear at 3K (70mph), the 3082R makes it basically N/A at that range, which makes me a bit sad after enjoying that torque.

Setting aside the (lack of) traction, sure the raped ape part of the "laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaggggg....RAPED-APE!!1!one!!1!11!1!!11" is really fun and rewarding, but the wait to get there always drove me nuts.

Can't wait to see how this decision pans out.

[sutyak]

OK, so I finally did some logging tonight and the 3082R spool isn't quite as bad as it feels. It's about 500RPM later than the 2871R after comparing some other logs. I am surprised how much I can feel that difference, though, especially hanging around the 3,000-3,500 RPM area. Unfortunately these logs are only pulling to 7K RPM, so the 3082R isn't getting to breathe yet. I need to adjust my rev limiter and shift light before any 8K pulls. I rely on the shift light because my tach only goes to 7K.

I also noticed my BOV is fully open at idle, which probably isn't helping my slow spool. I have a stiffer spring I just need to swap it out.
My exhaust is much louder now and I can hardly hear the BOV between shifts. It just sounds like a large volume of air releasing. No squeak/whistle/etc., which is nice.

Here is the spool time comparison from two logs. Both are WOT from approximately 2,500 RPM.
There is an obvious lag with the 3082R, and it's about 2-3psi lower until it spools up. The spikes are a bit different because of different wastegate springs.


Here is the MAF count comparison, or roughly translated the airflow. It would be safe to read this just like a dyno sheet. As long as the counts are climbing, it's making more power.
To be fair, the counts on the 2871R line are dropping because the boost is not holding. That being said, they have leveled off about 6,500 RPM and no longer climb.
The 3082R, as expected would continue to climb with as much RPM as I can give it.



All that being said, the 2871R is still more "fun" around town. However, if already rolling along and downshift to 4500-5000 RPM and stomp it then the 3082R spools FAST and hard. The 20psi is almost immediate, and wheel spin ensues.

Philly, I think 8K should be fine. 7K is the OEM redline, and my head is built with stronger valve springs and retainers. Some people rev to 8,500 RPM with this setup.
I don't have adjustable cam gears are the moment, but that could certainly help some.

[sutyak]

A couple pics I forgot to post.


Another note is I changed where I'm feeding the coolant from. I'm now using the 1/4" outlet which typically goes directly to the coolant expansion tank. I'm using 1/4" into turbo and 3/8" out. Now I can clearly watch the coolant constantly flow into the expansion tank from the turbo, and it also removes a restriction in the heater core lines.


The cast FSWerks manifold had some pretty sharp edges in it that I cleaned up and smoothed out to help airflow. I also painted it with 2000 degree VHT paint, and properly heat cycle cured it on my grill.



Everything heat wrapped. The turbo has a turbo blanket, but hard to see in the photo.
The glossy black paint on the dump tube is already burning off. It was 1200 degree Rustoleum grill paint I believe. I'll use 2000 degree VHT ceramic like is on the manifold and downpipe if I do it again.



A little heat tape on the turbo since it's nearly touching the manifold.

[somethingclever]

great info Mark....seems like if it were me, I would go back to the smaller turbo...then again I like diesel tractors. :)


I hope after all this work (aka..fun) on this fwd 5-door, you still use it for transporting around kids and fuel economy to work!

[sutyak]

great info Mark....seems like if it were me, I would go back to the smaller turbo...then again I like diesel tractors. :)


I hope after all this work (aka..fun) on this fwd 5-door, you still use it for transporting around kids and fuel economy to work!

At this point I highly doubt I'll go back to the 2871R (450hp). I may step down to a 3071R (500hp) or 3076R (550hp). Honestly the 3082R (700hp) wasn't in my sights when considering a bigger turbo. It was an accidental purchase that ended up being a unique/rare turbo that I just had to try. I'll never be able to use the entire flow potential of the 3082R.
I'll definitely be running the 3082R for the track rental in three weeks. I'm hoping that lag will help save my axles. After a second in 1st gear at the track a bit of turbo lag won't be noticeable. It's a fairly stout N/A motor anyway with the higher compression and cams, so it's not a dog off the line anyway.

[phillysrt4]

At this point I highly doubt I'll go back to the 2871R (450hp). I may step down to a 3071R (500hp) or 3076R (550hp).

the 3076 gets my vote if you're not keeping the 2871R. but it would be cool to run a dyno queen number with the 3082. It's perfect for that "800hp supra" power curve ;)

[sutyak]

Played around with my buddy's cheap action cam last night. Forgive the quality and camera placement.
I actually meant to turn it up to about 20psi, but overshot that and didn't even know until I checked the logs. Spike was 27psi, haha! Stock fuel pump is nothing short of amazing. 24psi at 7800 RPM and it wasn't leaning out. I target 10.2 AFR above 6500 RPM, so the jump to 24psi did push it leaner than I like.
Fuel cut sucked when I hit the rev limiter. The car actually shut off! It came right back on when I shifted to 4th, but my logging software stopped logging.
Clearly 24psi is useless for daily driving. It's 75% wheelspin. 17.5psi off the wastegate is enough for my low boost setting.

I also don't really care for the dumped wastegate. It ruins the sound of the turbo. That doesn't mean I'll pipe it back in, I just miss hearing the turbo.

3500RPM - 7800RPM